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Secrets in Shawano: Part 1: The Group and Their Leader Save Email Print
Posted: 7:15 PM May 19, 2008
Last Updated: 11:18 AM May 20, 2008
Reporter: Mikel Lauber
Email Address: mlauber@wsaw.com


A | A | A

Cults and extreme religious groups are grabbing headlines these days. After learning that another controversial group is operating right here in North Central Wisconsin, NewsChannel 7 set out to learn more about it, its members, and its elusive leader.

The controversy goes beyond a mysterious lifestyle. There's also concern about its financial impact on a community where it's invested millions in businesses and other properties.

This special series of investigative reports looks into a group many have wondered about - and speculated about - for years.

The existence of this group is no secret to those who live in the Shawano area. Local officials tell me members have been there for more than 30 years. But what has been, and still is a secret is just what their group is all about.

Over a period of several weeks we've been trying to learn more about their leader, a man now named Avraham Cohen, formerly known as Samanta Roy, and before that Rama Behera.

What we’ve found is he and his followers have always remained just out of sight.

Residents of Shawano and surrounding towns describe their community as old-fashioned and close-knit. It’s a place where word travels fast, and there are few secrets.

But for more than 30 years, one thing has eluded their small-town curiosity: a community within their community. "The group has been here for a number of years”, said Shawano Police Chief Ed Whealon. “I mean, as long as I’ve been with the department, since 1978, I believe the group first started in 1973 or 1974."

They've called themselves "The Disciples of the Lord Jesus Christ", led by a man then named Rama Behera.

Officials in the town of Westcott, just north of Shawano, say some of the first land purchased by Behera was a few acres in the town of Wescott, which they say serves as the group's compound.

The compound is guarded by group members 24 hours a day. Any stop at the building, or often even vehicles just driving past, prompts the group to call to the Sheriff's Deparment and begin videotaping.

Officials in the Town of Wescott say no one knows for sure what's inside this compound, which has been covered by tarps and closely guarded by the group for years. Officials say it's exactly that kind of secrecy that makes many residents uneasy. “What's inside of it? What are they doing? What are they doing behind it?”, asks Wescott Town Chairman Mike Schuler. “I don't have the slightest idea, and I’ve been here for 20 years. That's how tight it is."

And the mystery goes beyond the compound. No one seems to know how many members are involved with the group. And their leader has always remained in the shadows over the years. He's met with just a handful of local officials and business owners, and has been photographed just a couple of times.

He's also now gone by three names. First known as Rama Behera, court records show he changed his name to Samanta Roy in 1990, and last summer, changed it once again to Avraham Cohen.

Rick Ross is an internationally renowned expert in cults and religious groups whose institute for tracking such groups is based in New Jersey. He says the name change could be to escape criticism. "I would say this was because one name would be come well known to the general public and he sought to assume a new identity, and therefore avoid the criticism or baggage that went with former names”, said Ross.

Ross has followed Cohen’s group since the mid 90's and says he's seen the impact it's had on followers. "The people that have followed Rama Behera have followed, many of them for decades, since the 70's”, said Ross. “I've met people that literally gave up their life for this man. They gave a great deal of labor, a great deal of money, and it affected their personal life, every area of their life."

Ross says by controlling the environment his followers live and work in, Cohen is able to control their way of thinking.

Local officials say the group does not have a violent history. But in 2002, Gaeland Priebe, a former member of the group, was accused of repeated sexual assault of a child, crimes that took place after he left the group.
A major part of his defense involved the influence he says Behera's group had over him.

Testimony from former members gave accounts of shocking abuse. In a letter read in open court, one former member who left the group at age 10 stated, "Beatings by Rama were Rampant. Almost all children were targeted. Rama whipped me with an electric cord with frayed edges on both ends. He applied a cattle prod to the inside of my mouth, on my teeth, in my ears, on my neck, to my sides, and to the inside of my thighs."

A letter from another former member was also read in court, which said "Members became brainwashed into thinking that Rama represented God himself and had powers beyond that of the rank and file religious leader. Once trusted and feared as our spiritual leader, Rama regularly engaged in various physical and emotional abusive behaviors; all of which were used to obtain and maintain full control over his members' spiritual and personal lives."

Priebe was convicted and sentenced to 12 years in prison for the sexual assaults. No charges have ever come against Behera's group. "There have always been suspicions or allegations”, said Chief Whealon. “But nothing that law enforcement has ever been able to substantiate, as far as the Shawano Police Department has been involved."

Yet residents and local officials say it's not what's known about the group, but what remains unknown, that makes them worry. "You don't have problems with them in general, the people that are there itself”, said Schuler. “But we've already gone through a Waco, Texas. We just got through getting those children out of another home. Is this, are we having trouble in this home? Is this the next one? And what's behind it, I can't tell you. And it does get people nervous? Yes. It definitely gets people nervous."

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Posted by: Sheba on Aug 12, 2008 at 06:38 PM
We are not yesterday's news, we have been the past 20 years news. In 1984 there was a program about the cult too, 7 years ago and now this year...hmm I wonder how much more will happen in the future. Nothing's over until everyone is safe from him.

Posted by: hmm.. Location: everywhere on Aug 11, 2008 at 09:38 AM
looks like you guys are getting upset that you dont have an audience to perform to anymore ... sucks that you are yesterdays! news don't it .. hahahha

Posted by: FreeFromShawano on Aug 7, 2008 at 01:12 PM
If you are shot, you know it. If you are knifed, you know it. If someone slugs you in the face, you know it. If you are raped, you know it. The unique thing about being deceived is that when it happens to you, you do now know it -- you are not aware of it. That is why so many intelligent people stay stuck with Rama. But Rama is coming down -- his days are numbered. He is suffering defeat after defeat. All you followers who are sneeking a peek at this blog, please realize that there is life after Rama. Many have left and have experienced a quantum increase in their quality of life. And YOU WON'T GO TO HELL IF YOU LEAVE! Don't believe the lie that you will get no support from the heathens/Christians out in the world. We are there for you. Choose to leave now!

Posted by: Secure Location: In Christ on Aug 5, 2008 at 12:39 PM
It's pretty risky to wait till you die to find out your final destination...

Posted by: to Gene on Aug 3, 2008 at 10:44 AM
well said. Thanks for posting.

Posted by: Gene Location: Ohio on Aug 3, 2008 at 07:43 AM
Truth? Literal Bible? Arguing over these things is something like moving the deck chairs on the Titanic. We survivors need to tell the story of what happened to us, what is done in the dark corners, until the abuse stops. I personally have a spiritual experience, but I also struggle with Christianity. Much of the church rejects me, many of the Ex-"Brethren" are hostile to my choices about honesty about my life and my relationship to my creator. The I-Thou relationship with God is both individual and corporate. Mine was profoundly damaged by my experience in Shawano but I also refuse to let either Rama or his critics tell me what relationship I should have with God. It is something that will only be resolved when I die and for all the arrogance of those who pronounce me bound for Hell is the province of no one here on Earth. Any argument over it is wasted breath. The lasting truth I speak is that Rama delights in getting people to take risks to their own detriment & harm.

Posted by: to skeptical on Aug 2, 2008 at 05:08 PM
NO Jesus didn't let them down. But people are free moral agents with the Right to make choices. They were decieved and they made a conscious decision to go/attend/ & adhere to a man . You see, DECEPTION is a sly thing. It usually starts out in truth and as time wears on it slightly twists.. well- that is where a huge mis step takes place. BUT again, it's not Jesus letting down .. people lived out the choices they made and yes there is huge lies & imperfections in this world.

Posted by: To Too Much on Aug 2, 2008 at 04:39 PM
"Too much religion is no good." I agree. But there is a difference between religion and the Life that God can give you. The Lord Jesus called it "Living Water" to the woman at the well. It represents the Holy Spirit who wants to indwell people who believe in Jesus. The woman at the well drank it and was totally transformed. She ran into the city and told everyone about Jesus. She had religion before; after that experiance she had Life.

Posted by: To Skeptical on Aug 2, 2008 at 04:30 PM
That is a very good point that you make. It is amazing to me that someone like Dawn, for example, who was very dedicated to the Lord, could have been and still is so deceived. I, too, was totally deceived for 26 years, but eventually by reading the NT I saw the heresy and rotten fruit and got out. The answer to your question, I believe, is that they transfered their trust from Jesus to Rama. Those people totally trust in Rama. They think he is their salvation. So Jesus did not let them down, Rama did. If they witness to people, they do not tell about Jesus, but about Rama. When I was in, I told people about the great "man of God" I had met. I tried to get them to believe in Rama rather than in the Lord. He warned about deception with these words: "For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect." Thanks for your comment.

Posted by: skeptical Location: DC on Aug 2, 2008 at 09:49 AM
"Jesus Christ is the Lord, and if you put your trust in Him, He will never let you down." Many brethren were born again Christians who rejected the devil and his works and they still walked into a cult. Did Jesus let them down?

Posted by: Too Much Religion Location: Here and Now on Aug 1, 2008 at 10:26 PM
Too much religion is no good.

Posted by: Anonymous on Aug 1, 2008 at 04:01 PM
This is a place to liberate only the people in the cult, not out. Many people outside of the cult don't know anything about it. Stop preaching to those who left, they have seen and searched almost every religion out there. I personally, study a lot of religions and thus know that almost every religion preaches that they're the only way to salvation. Just try to get those inside the cult out, preach to them if you'd like, not to us.

Posted by: LJMR on Jul 31, 2008 at 06:54 PM
Re: "I have learned that because of the one way to heaven mindset that we were taught, that there is no one way." A teaches C; B teaches C; A is a fraud; Therefore B is a fraud. With logic like that, I think you would flunk any logic course you might take.

Posted by: The Devils Crusader Location: Betyouwanttoknow on Jul 31, 2008 at 05:23 PM
Can someone throw me a cold beer?

Posted by: LJMR on Jul 31, 2008 at 12:57 PM
I'm not trying to shove religion down your throats. I'm trying to liberate captives of Satan, whether they are in the cult or out of it, and the only way to do it is to speak the truth. Believe a lie if you want to, but the Lord Jesus is the Way, the Truth, and the Life, and there is no other path to God the Father but by Him. What am I doing to keep you from breathing, from thinking, from meditating, from praying? I want you to do all those things. I am just telling people what I have learned from many years of experience -- that Jesus Christ is the Lord, and if you put your trust in Him, He will never let you down.

Posted by: To To E & T Location: Don't tell me what I believe on Jul 31, 2008 at 12:09 AM
Get over the whole what I need to be following thing. I happen to still believe the Bible, God, etc.. have relevance. I also know that there is no one true religion/way/church. That is crap to make you feel trapped and stuck. I have been a member of churches before, attended synagogues, etc. So don't tell me to read the whole Bible. What makes you think I haven't? I have learned that because of the one way to heaven mindset that we were taught, that there is no one way. Don't start preaching that the only way to heaven is through Jesus cause I know that there are scriptures in the Bible that say that too. For me to agree with Buddha on this comment doesn't make me lost. It makes me saner than Rama wants me to be.

Posted by: Shoving the old time religion on Jul 30, 2008 at 07:03 PM
You are trying to shove religion down our throats just like Rama did. Let us breathe, think, meditate, pray...

Posted by: ET Location: Outer Space on Jul 30, 2008 at 09:05 AM
PHONE HOME! ALL YE FOLLOWERS! PHONE HOME! YOUR FAMILY WANTS YOU!

Posted by: To E & T on Jul 29, 2008 at 05:13 PM
Don't you remember singing, "Gimme that old time religion, it's good enough for S---" on the way out to Ballinger's? So now you say you don't want that "religion"? Seriously, most if not all of the 1st generation followers were born-again Christians who believed in and loved the Lord Jesus Christ (the "old-time religion"). They would have instantly rejected Buddha's sayings as from a demonic source, at least back then. The 2nd and 3rd generations are clueless about spiritual things due to Rama's warped teachings and behavior. I grieve for my own children stuck in Rama's theological dung pile. The Lord Jesus is all you need. Get to know Him by prayerfully reading the Bible -- all of it.

Posted by: Anonymous on Jul 26, 2008 at 11:07 AM
It has become deathly quite on here! Have they drank the Koolaid? Or what?

Posted by: Tabitha on Jul 25, 2008 at 10:02 PM
The quotes posted from Wisdom are all so dead on. So stop talking about where Buddha is, Wisdom isn't telling you the quote so you'll go follow Buddha you fool. It is merely wisdom so that we will consider everything before we jump to follow anything. We grew up in Rama's jumping to follow all the time to our detriment. I think a little wisdom from Buddha no matter where he is could have helped a little.

Posted by: Elina on Jul 25, 2008 at 05:16 PM
I reiterate a comment from a while ago: Are you members not talking because Rama said so? If that is the case, then you really are following him and under his control. Where's your self-worth?

Posted by: To Seeker on Jul 25, 2008 at 05:15 PM
No, Rama's actions are in no way excused by the fact that he is empowered by the devil, but it is important to know what supernatural source of power he has in order to effectively fight him. He certainly does have much blood in his hands for which he is directly responsible. Once I complained to him about something my wife was doing that I did not like. He said, "No one is going to escape." That includes Rama himself of course -- he will not escape judgement for what he has done...unless he thorougly repents, which seems pretty unlikely.

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jul 24, 2008 at 11:34 PM
ALLAH AKBAR! RAMA IS THE DEVIL!

Posted by: The_Seeker Location: United States on Jul 24, 2008 at 10:12 PM
People: Do you really think that Rama's actions may be excused by blaming it all on the Devil? Isn't that just a little bit far-fetched? What ever happened to personal responsibility for one's own actions? We can forgive but it is difficult to forgive someone who does not want forgiveness and is neither contrite nor remorseful. Yes Jesus said to forgive before forgiveness is requested but that doesn't seem to be working in this particular situation. I don't mean to be antiscriptures but this is simply unrealistic.

Posted by: Anonymous on Jul 24, 2008 at 06:55 PM
DOWN with the evil one, the puppet and right hand man of lucifer, satan, the devil in shawano, who destroyeth families in the name of the Lord, DOWN WITH RAMA! Amen.

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jul 24, 2008 at 06:03 PM
Focus Power - People. Let's take it to the man...the sick twisted pedophile who has come to be known as DUMBO. I like what Elina just said! Let's not fight each other. We can all have our own religious views...but what Rama and his people have going on is not a religion...it is a way to rape people of everything they have including their own life so one lunatic can live this life filled with money and power...and act out all of his perverse fantasies! DOWN WITH OLD BIG EARS!

Posted by: Re: Hating Rama on Jul 24, 2008 at 05:29 PM
The most damage you people consumed with hatred for Rama are doing is to yourselves. I hate what he has done with a passion, but as I said before, he is just a member of a hierarchy of puppets. Satan uses Rama as a puppet, and Rama pulls the strings attached to his followers. If you want to hate someone, hate the devil. Get saved and learn spiritual warfare techniques such as use of the blood of Jesus and the name of Jesus. All your name calling and "allah akbars" are not doing a thing to stop Rama. "They overcame him [the devil] by the blood of the Lamb and the word of their testimony, and they loved not their lives unto the death."

Posted by: To Stop It on Jul 24, 2008 at 05:12 PM
The NT records many instances where the Lord Jesus Christ quoted the Bible, most often the book of Deuteronomy. The simple people loved Him and accepted it, but the Jewish leaders hated it and crucified Him. The Bible tends to polarize people...

Posted by: Stop it Location: Bible Quoter on Jul 24, 2008 at 02:10 PM
To you who continue to quote the Bible in order to force it down people's throats: You are doing more harm than good. You think you are "witnessing" but you are driving people further away from the Lord. Use some discretion!

Posted by: Elina on Jul 24, 2008 at 01:42 PM
Anonymous July 19, awesome words about keeping the focus on the real issue at hand-Rama. We could go back and forth about religion and its' importance but in reality, it's going to have to be set aside I think in order for all of us to stay strong and united against the bigger evils. Let's not fight each other. Please.

Posted by: Wisdom on Jul 24, 2008 at 09:36 AM
The only thing necessary for the triumph of evil is for good men to do nothing. -Edmund Burke, 1770. The hottest places in hell are reserved for those who in a period of moral crisis maintain their neutrality. -Dante

Posted by: Be Reasonable Location: Ridiculous on Jul 24, 2008 at 09:34 AM
Just because Buddha may have said it doesn't mean it isn't true. Buddha could say a bear craps in the woods, and it would be true, but it doesn't make him a prophet. Get real and stop being ridiculous!

Posted by: Wisdom on Jul 24, 2008 at 09:32 AM
The propagandist's purpose is to make one set of people forget that certain other sets of people are human. -Aldous Huxley The shepherd always tries to persuade the sheep that their interests and his own are the same. -Stendhal

Posted by: Wisdom on Jul 24, 2008 at 09:23 AM
"The highest level of education is tolerance." -Helen Keller

Posted by: To: Words of wisdom on Jul 23, 2008 at 01:25 PM
Do not believe Buddha -- he is still in his tomb. But there is an empty tomb just outside of Jerusalem...

Posted by: Words of wisdom to live by on Jul 22, 2008 at 11:20 PM
"Do not believe in what you have heard; do not believe in traditions because they have been handed down for many generations; do not believe anything because it is rumored and spoken of by many; do not believe merely because the written statements of some old sage are produced; do not believe in conjectures; do not believe in that as a truth to which you have become attached by habit; do not believe merely on the authority of your teachers and elders. After observation and analysis, when it agrees with reason and is conducive to the good and benefit of one and all, then accept it and live up to it." -Buddha (2,600 years ago)

Posted by: Re: How to bring him down on Jul 21, 2008 at 08:19 PM
Except the LORD build the house, they labor in vain that build it: except the LORD keep the city, the watchman waketh but in vain. (Psalm 127:1) For the weapons of our warfare are not carnal, but mighty through God to the pulling down of strongholds: casting down imaginations and every high thing that exalteth itself against the knowledge of God, and bringing into captivity every thought to the obedience of Christ. (II Corinthians 10:4,5) It is a spiritual problem -- how can highly educated people be so deceived? It is demonic! It will only yield to spiritual solutions. We need to cry out to the Lord to set the captives free. If the Son shall set you free, you will be free indeed. (John 8:36)

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jul 21, 2008 at 04:58 PM
Welp I believe that WSAW is the almighty ones who decide what gets posted on this blog...not JC. They do own the domain so I would assume that they are the ones who approve the postings. I am pretty sure that this news clip was ran to tell the public about OLD BIG EARS and his clan...not create an environment so that people could preach back and forth. Destroy the one who has taken a majority of your life from you. Nobody has the answers to life...for some they have faith in God or even God(s)...but let's focus on taking it to DUMBO...not rattling off verses from the bible that RAMA himself brainwashed people with. My belief is an eye for an eye. So. Haters hate on!

Posted by: Anonymous on Jul 19, 2008 at 10:26 PM
you bring him down by exposing the facts he works hard to hide-his followers are not all dumb just ignorant, stubborn and afraid of him and the unknown-you break down fear by making fun of him, and healing ourselves at same time.

Posted by: TO devil & anonmous Location: around about on Jul 19, 2008 at 01:18 AM
OK then, keeping the eyes on the prize - bring down RAMA - yes #1 goal. HOW??? how do you/we/they bring down the jew wannabee hindu ?? how?

Posted by: Anonymous Location: in the corner on Jul 18, 2008 at 02:05 PM
hey people, if there is something you don't like that is posted (gotta love religion for all its uniting qualities) ignore it and and keep ur eye on the prize BRING DOWN RAMA the control freak-GET OUR FAMILIES BACK!

Posted by: to "current devil" Location: around about on Jul 18, 2008 at 11:22 AM
yes Devil you have a right & a choice. One day when you stand & face HIM, you'll be reminded of your last post. all I am saying is God has a destiny for each one of us. The crazy unforgivable s*** that happened to you and everyone else is a workings of a horrible man with big ears/ yes yes yes we know that, it wasn't God who authored any of the junk. We all have people in there we love & want back. the person I know is a professional , degreed w/ 8 years of college & a total puppet, living a so so life, poorer than a college student. I see kids who beg their parents to "leave & run away" and be all alone. So BRING DOWN THE HATED MAN - YES fine! But quit acting like a life & destiny & God aren't part of the equation too...

Posted by: LJMR on Jul 18, 2008 at 10:30 AM
I don't want to be contentious, but did WSAW authorize you to speak for them as to the purpose of this blog? The Ramaites could say the same thing: "I respect your right to your own beliefs but don't push them onto others." They believe Rama is their salvation, so who are you to dispute that? You are pushing your belief that he is not their salvation. I happen to agree with that, but don't be a big hypocrite by trying to censor this blog. You are well representing the wicked being whose name you post under. I'm thankful the person who originally used it came to his senses and stopped. Whether you like it or not, Jesus Christ is the General Manager of the Universe, and it is He who determines what gets posted here, not you.

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jul 17, 2008 at 09:12 PM
This blog was put up to discuss the the facts of DR RUDUMB! It was not put here to convince people to join a particular religion or convince people to believe in Jesus Christ! Like "Disgusted with Religious Folk" said: I respect your right to your own beliefs but don't push them onto others. That's exactly why so many people joined Dumbo's quest for total manipulation. And LJMR I know for a fact that my father did not in fact "recruit" you into Rama's molestation circle! Using the alias "The Devil" is open to be used by anybody who sees fit. The funny thing is I have been posting all over these blogs as different names...and most recently felt I should carry on "The Devil's" torch...since he/she started with some very good stuff and then there was to long of an absence...So look out for all my aliases. They all say the same thing...DOWN WITH OLD BIG EARS. The reason this blog exists...exploitation of religion. If I am going to hell for not believing in something! So be it! MY CHOICE!

Posted by: to "disgusted" on Jul 17, 2008 at 11:45 AM
hahahahaa you sound like someone I know hahahaa shut up (troy?)

Posted by: LJMR on Jul 17, 2008 at 12:04 AM
And speaking of recruiting, it was your father that recruited me into this god-forsaken community that we have been discussing. In no way do I fault him – he was a good friend, and we were both deceived by something that appeared very good. I also am responsible for indirectly recruiting many to follow Rama. For that reason I have a responsibility to help people out of the deception and spiritual darkness that is Rama’s legacy to them.

Posted by: SG Location: around about on Jul 16, 2008 at 11:14 PM
CONT... Devil.. raise hell ..it's OK - he deserves it!!!! But let everyone else work their process out for themselves too! EVERYONE ELSE- you fed up w/ jew wannabee power mad nutjob???? Just leave!!!!, start a new life,get a few bucks, get a home, an education, a love, a family, you don't have to hug & kiss JESUS today - but why don't you , on your path, just send up a small prayer.... that if God is real & Jesus is essential , that He would maybe, make Himself real TO YOU. Wait & see what He does. IT'S WORTH A TRY , HUH? All this Bull **** is not His deal, it's a crazy road that is meant to holdup outstanding individuals from walking in their true DESTINYS!

Posted by: SG Location: around about on Jul 16, 2008 at 11:07 PM
Hey DEVIL, c'mon - give it a rest. There is a focus to reach beyond just the demise of allah akbar(haha very funny BTW) DISAPPOINTED & ANONYMOUS: thnx for your thoughts & encouragements. Jojimon could fall into the 'power whirlwind' but there are Men of God w/ hearts on fire and humble & reverent ... Men after God's own heart Like David and men who were God's "friend" like Enoch & Elijah. If a man ( or jojimon ) has a 'call' there are systems of 'checks & balances' to keep even men in authority on the straight & narrow. NOT DISAPPOINTED : yes I think you spelled Don's name correctly. He had an amazing ministry, very powerful.These posts are correct - the "cancer" that eats away is not originating in the Father God or His Son Jesus. Finding healing & self discovery on your own path will be a long & empty path. I wish people would stop THROWING THE BABY OUT W/ THE BATH WATER. DEVIL: the purpose of this blog is MULTI DIMENSIONAL .. go ahead vent, raise hell

Posted by: Disgusted with Religious Folk Location: Please Stop on Jul 16, 2008 at 10:18 PM
I just have to voice my disgust with those bloggers who come on this website and try to spread their religious views. WE DON'T WANT TO HEAR THEM! How do you KNOW your particular version of God is correct? You don't! So I think it is pompous of you to try to impose it upon other people. If that's what you want to believe, I respect that, but KEEP IT TO YOURSELF and respect others for how they choose to believe. You do NOT have any ACTUAL FACTS that make YOUR THEORY/RELIGOUS VIEW THE RIGHT ONE so stop being presumptious and just tell the world, "This is what I believe; how do you see it?" PLEASE STOP!!! These blogs are meant to reveal truths about Rama, NOT try to spread YOUR beliefs!!!

Posted by: LJMR on Jul 16, 2008 at 10:03 PM
Solicitation for God...WOW! It's called the assertion of truth...

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jul 16, 2008 at 02:55 PM
This blog was not meant to recruit followers of Jesus Christ. I don't believe God or religion should be solicited like a product for sale.

Posted by: To Elina on Jul 16, 2008 at 01:47 PM
You said: "we reserve the right (ALL ex-members) to have our opinions and beliefs regardless of the past and what it did to our views of the bible and god." Certainly you do. But you deserve to know the truth about salvation, which Rama denied you. You deserve to know the truth that God is holy and that the only way sinful man can be accepted by a just and holy God is to be totally cleansed from that sin. That is why the Lord Jesus died as a sacrifice for our sins, because we could never make ourselves clean. You are totally free to reject that truth, but you deserve to hear it because Rama's twisted theology never made it clear. People who reject the Bible and the truth in it are just letting Rama continue to have influence over their lives to their own detriment.

Posted by: Not disappointed in Lord Jesus on Jul 16, 2008 at 01:30 PM
I assume you mean "no way" instead of "now way." There is some evidence he was somewhat off tract in 1974, but I'm not sure he was before his first trip to India. Some pastors told him not to go cuz he was not mature enough in the Lord, but he went anyway and their assessment was that he came back indwelt by a big hindu demon. After the trip he told Don Photenhauer (sp?), whose church Rama had spoken at in Blain MN that God had appeared to him and told him he was Elijah the Prophet. Don said, "No you are not!" and that was the end of their relationship. You won't like this, but until you get born again, you will never be able to understand spiritual things. Don't let your spiritual heritage from Rama keep you from trusting in the Lord Jesus for your salvation. Read the NT and ask the Lord to give you eternal life. That's what I did as a student at ISU long ago, and the Bible went from a dry, boring book to something I could hardly put down. God loves you.

Posted by: Elina on Jul 16, 2008 at 08:47 AM
To Disappointed: please read my post on Part 3, under Elina Grace on July 10th. This is in a small rebuttal to "Not dissapointed in Lord Jesus" on July 15th. You make good arguments but my feelings and many, many others are reflected in that post. When I'm ready I would love to talk to you more about this subject but right now it's too painful and anything I hear defending the biblical perspective on life feels like a stab in the healing process. I am very sorry. This is in no way meant to deter you though from exposing the truth to those who are still brainwashed. I only say this because you mentioned ex-members.

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jul 16, 2008 at 08:41 AM
Rama in now way "got way off track"! He set this up in the scheme to con as many people as possible and make a living doing nothing but deceiving people. Q: Did Rama ever have a job even at the beginning? A: NO, He set out to con people and it got easier as the years went on!

Posted by: Not disappointed in Lord Jesus on Jul 15, 2008 at 08:38 PM
Not all Indian spiritual teachers are bad -- some are very godly men who have done a lot of good. Two that I am familiar with are Sadhu Sundar Singh and Sadhu Sundar Selvaraj. Sadhu Singh lived in the first part of the 20th century and finished strong. You can read about him at http://sadhusundarsingh.homestead.com/files/introduction.html. Sadhu Selvaraj is alive and has an active ministry faithful to the Lord Jesus. You can read his testimony at http://www.jesusministries.org/aboutus_1.html. These men are/were definitely not deceivers or frauds. I can understand how Rama made you suspicious and cynical, but you don't reject a $20 bill just because there are counterfeits, do you? There is a God and he loves you betrayed members and ex-members and wants you to know Him. One key to my getting out was the book "God's Generals." It tells how some men of God finished their life well, but how others, like Rama, who had something at first, got way off track at the end of their lives

Posted by: Anonymous on Jul 15, 2008 at 03:47 PM
Just wait till Jojimon gets a following that says "yes Brother" to everything he says, carries his umbrella, carries his boots, cleans his boots with a toothbrush, kisses his toes, bows down to him, walks backward around him, stands at attention whenever he comes into the room, interrupts the worship of God/Lord Jesus because His Majesty the Brother walked into the meeting room. Then he'll suck it all in to his head and demand more and more power, control and money until what he has for a following are "yes brother broke slaves"! Hopefully little Jojimon is more humble and godly...but because so many of us were screwed by Rama and taken advantage of in the name of the Lord, we are very skeptical and cynical of "God's hand" working in/through people.

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jul 15, 2008 at 03:10 PM
TOOL

Posted by: Daffodiles Location: Orissa mud hut looking for the porcelain throne on Jul 15, 2008 at 02:04 PM
This guy sounds like another FRAUD! ALLAH AKBAR

Posted by: Disappointed on Jul 15, 2008 at 11:32 AM
Even though I have been disappointed by Rama, I have never been disappointed by the Lord Jesus. He has proven to be faithful time and time again. He promised to give us not only eternal life, but an abundant life...a life of peace, joy, contentment, purpose, fulfillment, and satisfaction. If you are not experiencing those things, transfer your allegiance from Rama, or whatever else has first place in your life, to the Lord Jesus Christ. Put your trust in Him and you will never be disappointed.

Posted by: Disappointed on Jul 15, 2008 at 11:21 AM
The article goes on to quote the young Incian evangelist as follows: "I accepted Jesus as my Lord and Savior at age seven," Jojimon said. "I started to minister after I heard the Spirit of the Lord speak to me." His pastor recognized God's hand on the boy and encouraged him in the ministry. Other ministers first doubted whether God could use a boy in preaching the Gospel, but after hearing him acknowledged he had a good command over his subject. Jojimon still goes to school and lives with his family. Source: James Varghese and Joel News

Posted by: Disappointed on Jul 15, 2008 at 11:18 AM
When we first came in 1974, Rama talked about the "Big, big meetings" at which he would be preaching the gospel. We were excited to think about how we would be part of the great things the Lord would be doing in the last days. Somewhere along the way something went wrong. I just found the following report and imagined how this could have been Rama if he would have remained true to the gospel. India: 12-year old evangelist called into ministry A boy in Kerala, India, who was mute until he was three and suffered from severe stammering until age seven, is now at age 12 an active preaching evangelist. Jojimon has ministered in almost 1,600 meetings in India as well as the United Arab Emirates, Qatar, Kuwait, Singapore, Australia, South Africa and Kenya. One meeting outside Kerala, in the state of Andhra Pradesh, Kazipet Railway Stadium, was attended by 35,000 people.

Posted by: Anonymous on Jul 14, 2008 at 07:51 AM
Rama will not repent...he loves extorting money and dividing families too much...he is doing so right now for his tax bill is due! SO BRING HIM DOWN! DOWN WITH RAMA!

Posted by: To Sheba on Jul 13, 2008 at 11:15 PM
Re: "Rama's Trauma" Most of us probably think of the trauma that Rama has caused us, but just consider the trauma that is now inflicted upon him. Imagine being a control freak for 34 years -- controlling hundreds of people with no one daring to confront him -- just "Yes brother, sorry brother, I'll be good brother, right away brother." And then these blogs appearing which are totally out of his control! Imagine the trauma to Rama -- now it is his turn to live in dread and fear of the next rebuke. As someone said, "You reap what you sow," and "When your strength goes down, your iniquities will visit you." Now is the time for Rama to repent.

Posted by: Gene Location: Ohio on Jul 13, 2008 at 07:58 AM
I have done a great deal of work to recover from the major trauma my involvement with this group caused. Much of the dynamics are overpowering and overwhelming. I wondered at myself how I could so easily have fallen into the hands of this man. I was not dumb. I was certainly upset and my life had been rendered unstable and Rama caught me at that moment of instability and was a master at keeping me off balance until long after I left and found some expert help at the Wellspring center. Attacks on the survivors for their behavior as a result of Rama's wounding only congratulates Rama for his skill. Attacks on current members are futile because they will remain clueless as long as they are under the influence. What is needed is a scrutiny of any child abuse that may surface and I am personally convinced that it will because an animal can never change its spots. The sad thing is someone else will probable get caught. Glenn B beat Brad and Brian, it will probably be another parent.

Posted by: Gene Location: Ohio on Jul 13, 2008 at 07:30 AM
Since some of the discussion has been on Education -Rama explicitly ordered me to discontinue my education when I was 9 semester credits short of completing a BA Cum Laude at Wabash College in 1974. I returned to complete that degree over the objection of my ex-wife and without the agreement of Rama in 1983 as one of my first (gasp) acts of independence. It led Rama to tell the brethren to shun me and they did. I went to Rama for help, thought I found it and then found that he publicly talked about confidentially revealed information - my sexuality as if it was revealed directly from God. I left the Northeast Wisconsin wounded and wanting nothing to do with the cancer in Shawano. I also realize that my silence in the matter means that ***in my opinion *** the bastard is getting away with child abuse, "rape", importuning, slave trading and economic exploitation, abuse of the legal system, intimidation of witnesses, and more. I lived for 3 years in his house as his Levi / slave.

Posted by: Sheba on Jul 13, 2008 at 03:52 AM
Thank you, I think. I hope that everyone can write and share their experiences. We all experienced different things (although a lot of it was also the same), and it would be interesting and a learning experience to hear everyone's "side"/story.

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jul 12, 2008 at 10:58 AM
I like that "Rama's Trauma"! You are very right though Sheba. I think if anybody writes a book about this cult that should be the title.

Posted by: Sheba on Jul 12, 2008 at 04:10 AM
It's hard to band people together when they are scared, although sometimes that's what bands people together, such as all you brethren still in it. Fear of going to hell, fear of Rama, fear of lots of things he has told you. It is hard since we still have some of that fear instilled in us and it stops people from banning together. A lot of people think by ignoring their past, they are healing from Rama's trauma.

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jul 11, 2008 at 04:10 PM
If you're already getting tired you must not have much stamina. I am just getting things started. The mud has yet to be flung. Lot's of words have been thrown from the righteous side...and lots of sh** has been flung from the brainwashed puppets who hath been instructed by there courageous leader...who most certainly wouldn't stand up for himself while he has women and children to take his place! If you're looking for evil minions you may have to turn your direction of sight a full 180 degrees kinda like an owl...the plan hath been set from day one...and one day like a well thought out game of chess...the king shall fall...and not to anything less than a pawn. so watch closely as the old big ears just might crap his pants. just be glad you aren't the one who has to wash his clothes at night!

Posted by: Anonymous on Jul 10, 2008 at 08:11 PM
You were little, you were born into it, your whole life was it. You have every right to say what you say and they should listen to it. It's the only right thing to do. Weren't we always taught to listen to others, to be open minded and taught good things about jewish people, to be more sympathetic to the underprivileged? Well I think they should listen to us, because we've already heard everything they've had to say since we were in the cult.

Posted by: to Devil on Jul 10, 2008 at 07:15 PM
hahaha devil...i like you still! Pass the kool aide! ok but Devil- come up w/ a plan all this talk and mud slinging is tiring me out! HOW do you do something?! Make a change happen.. get the place disbanded? How ?? C'mon get your 'cohorts' your evil minions together - construct a plan.

Posted by: Elina on Jul 10, 2008 at 04:09 PM
Issachar related to me that he once stood up in a meeting and asked to go to the bathroom. Rama asked him if he had 5 dollars. Issy said no, and Rama said he couldn't go. He was just a little boy! Nevermind anything I've said, talk to the little ones.

Posted by: To: To Ann & Anonymous Location: Who Gives on Jul 10, 2008 at 02:45 AM
He said that God would be coming back in the year switch from 1999 to 2000 too. Remember? He switched the rules, the stories, AND the punishments up more times than I can count. Thank you for teaching me inconsistency Brother! Thank you for teaching me to always feel fearful and doubtful! Go to school, no don't go to school. Eat pork, no don't eat pork. Well and the food to change the most, peanut butter and jelly! My goodness, I would go a year without eating that. Then all of the sudden, eat peanut butter and jelly. Brother, may I go bathroom please? in a meeting? Yes, you may go to the bathroom. That Tabitha she's such a good girl. No, Tabitha. Ha ha ha! Go in your pants! ha ha ha. God, protect that Tabitha from the world. ha ha. Brother, may I? You smug bastard! You know he doesn't even go home to chuckle to himself about what he gets away with. Why do you think he laughs in the middle of the meeting about being asked to go to the bathroom? Such a good example of godliness to me.

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jul 9, 2008 at 09:29 PM
That was was clever sir...or should I say PUPPET. Is the old ear flapper getting offended by his name calling. You know what they say what goes around comes around. Remember when RAM-DAM used to make fun of Laban for having different ears and would torment him as a child calling him "Mickey Mouse"...well look what happened. Old Dumbo's ears kept growing...it looks like he may just take flight at anytime...flap flap...maybe when everything goes down...he'll pass around the kool-aid for all of you skirt tuggers and then he'll fly away with those things growing out of the sides of his head. oh by the way. Tweet Tweet!!

Posted by: Guess Who Location: In the pond on Jul 9, 2008 at 09:03 PM
First off you are assuming that the Devil is one of the Kindseth kids. Your wrong by the way! But if you want to talk about the "Kindseth Family" Trait then you would have to admit they all have the same Dad since that doesn't run on their mother's side of the family. It definately is a Kindseth trait. SO much for your theory on them not having the same dad.

Posted by: GOAT Location: watching for the CON ARTIST on Jul 9, 2008 at 08:30 PM
Well, speaking of beaks, where's your high and mighty DUMBO this week. You should probably check out his snout before you start talking about beaks and noses. Besides, lets get back to the facts, answer some substantive questions here? Call upon your great Sadhu to come forth from his throne in Baltimore and answer the questions. Obviously you are another one of his DEADBEAT dads, hiding like a worm in your tunnels.

Posted by: Hey Devil on Jul 9, 2008 at 06:43 PM
Do you have big ears? Or are they small? You seem obsessed with ears. Check out the family nose, now that's something to talk about. It's not really a nose, more of a beak.

Posted by: Anonymous on Jul 9, 2008 at 06:39 PM
Oh I have the guts, but you are watching us remember? Who am I?

Posted by: Saw it all Location: Freedom on Jul 9, 2008 at 10:56 AM
College kids who joined rama in the mid 70s did quit college. There were many of them. You know who you are, you're in your 50s now if you're not dead already. Kids who finished high school in the late 70s were not allowed to go to college or vocational school and were ridiculed by rama himself if they expressed a desire to do so. Rama said college was unnecessary since the Lord's return would be in the next few years. Rama changed the rules about his followers going to college however when HIS son reached college age. Suddenly rama decided education was important and his son was taken to college along with his daughter shortly after, and the brethren footed the bills to pay tuition for his kids and to house rama's family and servants in Boston. (In no way am I blaming rama's kids; it wasn't their fault and they were victims too.) It is so obvious rama changes the rules to suit his selfish motives. Wake up people!

Posted by: to To Ann on at 06:09 PM on Jul 8, 2008 at 11:01 PM
"Interesting you say that about the Dr. telling people not to go to school." FINISH READING the post before you post! Ann never said DOCTOR Fraud never told people to go to school. She said that he is full of contradictions because he told brethren in the 70's to quit college (not go to school) since Jesus was coming back any day, brethren like Ann, Thor, Deanna, Sarah(?), Arden, Lori, Nancy, Cheri, Gene(?), Mike(?) Carol(?) etc. THEN when it was time for HIS children to go to college, then his tune changed and he decided that every one should go to college and everyone should be lawyers and doctors for His Greatness even if they weren't cut out for it our desired that. (Some did become lawyers and doctors) THEN his tune changed again when he bought up all the businesses and needed slaves to work them. He isnt "pushing" his slaves to go to college even though some would do very well. CONTRADICTIONS were what Ann was talking about.

Posted by: to the PUPPETS Location: in the pickle barrel on Jul 8, 2008 at 10:32 PM
The parents knew about some of the instances of abuse that went on, they didn't know about a lot of other stuff that Rama did when parents weren't around....and some people aren't born public speakers...quit picking at every little word they say and twisting their stories. You KNOW what Elina said is true even though she may not have been as articulate at that moment in time as she would have liked to be.

Posted by: Ann Location: Peaceful Place on Jul 8, 2008 at 10:03 PM
We were told not to go to school back in 1975 because Jesus was coming back soon and we didn't need it. Later when it suited his purpose, he sent his son and many of us to school. If you aren't smart enought to figure out that's what I'm talking about . . . And why don't you have the GUTS to say who you are?

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jul 8, 2008 at 09:44 PM
I love the rationalization you current monkeys make! "soon in universe time is thousands of years" wow. I can't even say much to that it is so ridiculous. that's the best rebuttal old big ears with a doctorate could come up with. wake up all ye rudumberite puppets. dr. dumbo the molester has no prophecies but raping all of you for everything you are worth. why don't you explain to the brain surgeon the simple business equation of supply and demand. maybe then he will buy some more gas for your godly petro stations...oh wait it's probably getting pretty tough for the con artist to get gas since he has screwed over several of the suppliers.

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jul 8, 2008 at 07:18 PM
Yes some were encouraged to go to school...of course only to better the big eared child molester. however, many were denied the privilege to go to school and choose the life they want to live...instead they were put to work slaving away at this piece of trash' businesses or maybe by slaving away at his place in baltimore doing god knows what! probably stuff that would sicken me to even think about! that sick twisted freak needs to be put through the torment he has inflicted on so many innocent human beings!

Posted by: To Ann on Jul 8, 2008 at 06:26 PM
Soon, by whose calendar, yours? Did you expect him to come down from heaven and land in your back yard? Get real, soon in universe time is thousands of years. You are not even a teeny, tiny speck in time.

Posted by: To Ann on Jul 8, 2008 at 06:09 PM
Interesting you say that about the Dr. telling people not to go to school. You are straight up lying and even the ex-members can tell you that. Read in earlier posting they were complaining about being push to go to school. Even you were told that it would be good for you to go back to school. Like mother like daughter, liars.

Posted by: To Ann on Jul 8, 2008 at 06:05 PM
Have your "peaceful" place. Nobody else want's your kind of peace.

Posted by: Anonymous on Jul 8, 2008 at 06:04 PM
Didn’t Elina say that her dad saw that her bottom, back and legs were all bruised from beatings. How could she say 5 minutes later, that “they were out working in the field and had no idea what was going on.”

Posted by: To Ann on Jul 8, 2008 at 05:59 PM
How can Elina say her parents didn’t know anything yet then say “I can remember my parents faces contorteing just from the smell”

Posted by: Ann to the 2nd person calling herself Ann Location: to the one who wrote July 7th at 6:20 on Jul 8, 2008 at 01:14 AM
"She contradicts herself on everything she says?" My lovely daughter WAS abused by Rama-you weren't always in the room with her-FOR THE RECORD!!! She is still coming to grips with all the trauma she experienced-the inconsistencies from Rama with his mind games and his playing with people's emotions. So I am proud that she is rising above it, and working through the crappy past. Furthermore, the pot is calling the kettle black! Rama contradicts himself all the time-Sometimes things were acceptable and other times they weren't-all at his whim-plus his predictions that did not come true (Jesus coming back soon (1975), rationing salt, colder and colder winters), changing the rules (can eat pork, then can't), having no use for higher educ, then sending Robie to school. Boasted in the beginning about no collection plate, but then started the bucket. Calling himself a neurosurgeon? He has delusions of grandeur. You've got no defense for him so you tear down others.

Posted by: Guess Who Location: Wouldn't you like to know on Jul 7, 2008 at 07:29 PM
Just finished reading a really enlightening book. You should all read it. The title of the book is called Stolen Innocence by Elissa Wall. Can you say deja vu? Very good book and as the last person that posted at 6:20pm on July 7th has shown, you will do and say anything to cover up the wrong doings committed by a man calling himself a man of God. He and Warren Jeffs should get a cell together and spend the rest of their lives in a prison where people that have been tormented by them can torment them for a while. I will bring the wire whip and I am sure others could bring the weapon that was used to torment them. Oh and have you forgotten that Rama has had under aged girls get married also??

Posted by: Ann on Jul 7, 2008 at 06:20 PM
Seems to me your lovely daughter can't make up her mind on many things. Listen to her story about life in the group. She changes her stories at least a dozen times. Shall I write them for you, and tell the world? She contradicts herself on everything she says. Not a child I would be proud of. And just for the record, she was never abused by the group leader. We are the same age and "stayed in one big room together."

Posted by: Ann Location: Peaceful Place on Jul 4, 2008 at 02:58 PM
I know the children will never understand, but when we adults first went to Rama's it was not like that. I was searching for "God's perfect truth" and thought it was not in the churches-miracles, etc. that were in the Bible weren't happening in the churches. They seemed to be happening at Rama's. Also, he seemed to be able to "see your spirit." Now I think he was extremely charismatic and intuitive, but at the time it seemed he would only know it if God showed him. Everything was really positive at the beginning and we were so happy. We got hooked, and believed he was the servant of the Lord, and if we left we'd go to hell. And even when things went downhill, we thought we could tolerate anything if it would get us to heaven. I know it sounds crazy-it absolutely was crazy. There is so much I would do over again if I could. I apologize to all of you from the bottom of my heart to the extent I ever perpetuated any of it. I wish you all grace and healing.

Posted by: to "this guy" on Jul 4, 2008 at 01:28 AM
CONT.... because they are owned, or blackmailed or really believe the bill of goods they were sold that they will be cursed, their seed, like david and solomon & absolom's kingdom divided!!!( verbatim) Geeezzz but the way to bring the house of cards down is to pray the God intervenes, gets rid of the false prophet...(when i say get rid- i don't mean death or anything crazy) I mean removed, disbanned, maybe the "brethren" wake up and pull their heads out of their amish a** and realize there is better for their kids, maybe they'd leave. If You"guy" have a heart or burden for this- pursue it, contact the mayor, start knocking on doors, give it a shot. I can't , I loose sleep this makes me crazy trying to understand this stuff. I do know the majority of people out there revere & love & fear God & want to do 'right' things.

Posted by: TO "this guy" on Jul 4, 2008 at 01:16 AM
Yes, but how to get am investigation? WSAW did a week long report...did anyone get in? NO. There are certain religious rights, privacy, property rights etc etc. Who could step in? No one will be beaten or whipped the day authorities show up. ...It's like this: a woman has a ding ding in her car/she takes it to the service shop/ does it ding ding for the mechanic? oH NO of course not/ as she drives away the car ding dings all the way home. Get it? it would be the same for the rama group. everything would appear normal & peaceful. now people i know... DO have a clue about the outside world, they are 'normal' professionals coming here & there, associating w/ all sorts of people. They go to health clubs, concerts, restaurants, professional clubs, go to movies, go on vacations etc etc THEY ARE THERE BY FREE WILL FREE CHOICE. They drag their kids into that hell hole BECAUSE they believe w/ all their hearts that its right...OR because

Posted by: This Guy Location: A Better Place on Jul 3, 2008 at 08:25 PM
I really don't know how to go about saving the children. I do agree with you though that it is hard to do being the parents, grandparents, aunts, and unlces are to blind to see what they are actually doing to there children. I just think that with all the posts about Rama and the things that go on there should be enough reason alone to at least do an investigation of Rama's whole compound! Who cares if its been more than ten years!! That is just a number and there is innocent children!! The things a lot of us on here went through went on for more than ten years and it is things we still think about every day and we will have to deal with for the rest of our lives! I never knew that anything could be done when I decided I wanted out!! Its because we never knew anything about the outside world!!

Posted by: The Devils Crusader Location: Betyouwanttoknow on Jul 3, 2008 at 08:24 PM
You know, I hear your plea for a beer and a smoke. I also need a damn lap dance! Or a gigantic party at your hotel. Something! Skittles! Midgets? Balloons?

Posted by: Guess Who on Jul 3, 2008 at 11:20 AM
Like your comment "Excuse me brother" - I agree if you want to be such a pillar of the community, shouldn't you be up to date on your bills. Oh that's right you are above the laws of the land. ANd rama thinks he is God. Hopefully he isn't setting you all up to take the fall for him when he goes crashing down. I feel for the ones on the board especially the CEO. Hope you don't sit in jail for the rest of your life because he set you up.

Posted by: Excuse me Brother Location: Your gas stations on Jul 2, 2008 at 11:36 PM
Excuse me Brother, where shall we buy our beer and cigarettes now since your liquor and cigarette licenses have been suspended? I can't wait until you squeeze a quarter million more dollars out of your exhausted and overextended devotees to pay your taxes. I want my beer and cigarettes now! Is it okay if I buy them from a heathen gas station? How come the heathens pay their taxes but you don't? Answer quick! I am thirsty and I need a smoke! PS if I eat some chocolate will I get rebuked?

Posted by: to this guy Location: a better place on Jul 1, 2008 at 01:03 PM
OK how do you propose "saving the children"? You can't take them away from their fools the parents... if both parents aren't there - then one of the fools on the outside STILL want there kids going every single pathetic weekend!!! go figure... HOW do you save them? If their poor dillusional parents wants to be there in a hell hole- then the poor precious children are stuck in hell too. So they (kids)get to be un socialized, a.d.d., a.d.h.d., insecure,crying, bed wetters, craving normalcy, not knowing a healthy mom healthy dad, loving God, gracious salvation, AND IT'S THE FAULT OF MOM, DAD,GRANDPARENTS, FAKE AUNTS, FAKE UNCLES, BRETHREN, RAMA the blood is on their hands. I have found it easier to cut off the heart/distance yourself from the kids because if you don't- you'll care so much till it makes you crazy and there is NOTHING you can do to help if the lost souls that are parents FREELY CHOOSE BONDAGE. sorry to be so glum... unless God steps in!!!

Posted by: This Guy Location: A Better Place on Jun 29, 2008 at 04:43 PM
The only way that i think that they shouldn't butt out is that if they are trying to SAVE THE CHILDREN!! I have a child of my own and knowing what goes on there that would be my goal!! I went through the beating with 2x4 electrical wires or pretty much what ever Rama (or what ever his name is now)could get his hands on!! I just think back that I never had a choice as a child and the kids that are there now are in the same boat!!

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jun 26, 2008 at 05:25 PM
The parents didn't join a cult with a sick twisted leader. I am sure none of them would have joined had they known what it would turn into. And even so of course they are gonna blame the one and only piece of goose crap known as RAMBLEDAMBLEDUMBO!

Posted by: Anonymous Location: NY on Jun 26, 2008 at 03:39 PM
I know someone who is a former member of this cult, and the only thing I dont understand is why they blame Rama. What about your parents people? Rama didnt kidnap your parents and force them into the cult. Your parents made the CHOICE to go there and stay there. On the other hand I do think something needs to be done about this cult...how can something go on like this without anyone investigating? Peoples lives are ruined and children are abused everyday. Ive seen the scars and heard the stories , I know.

Posted by: to bathsheba Location: u care on Jun 26, 2008 at 02:24 PM
YES ...you are right...NO ONE should butt out!!!! probably nothing will change BUT if you make the "enviornment" uncomfortable enough something HAS to change... turn up the heat...TURN IT UP!

Posted by: Bath-sheba Location: I care on Jun 26, 2008 at 02:43 AM
I don't think people should butt out, otherwise nothing will change.

Posted by: THIS GUY Location: A BETTER PLACE on Jun 25, 2008 at 07:30 PM
I would like to agree 1 million percent with guess who!! and like guess who said everyone that hasn't been a part of the cult should butt out! I wish that as a child I would have never had to go through the beatings and everything else that went on!! I wish I would have known of the life outside of that horrific place!! I wouldn't wish that life on my worst enemy!

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jun 24, 2008 at 12:21 PM
Malicai - children of the corn yo!

Posted by: DooBeePoo Location: Fraling road on Jun 24, 2008 at 09:33 AM
To lawnguy: Don't worry about the pitchforks. They don't use them for battle. But watch out for other weapons, especially the kind that go "bang."

Posted by: lawnguy Location: N.E.W on Jun 23, 2008 at 10:20 PM
i don't know much about the cult but i've been researching a little bit in the last few days. this girl i know told me about a time she drove down some cul-de-sac in Shawano and there was some lady sitting in a car, almost like a lookout. then when they drove by she flashed her lights and old-fashioned, almost amish looking folks came out of the woodwork carrying pitchforks and started running towards them. they booked outta there and asked some dude at the g-station and he just said to stay away from that area, that those people are nuts. so, despite the advise they went back to the area only to be chased out by the old lady in her car and more crazy folks with pitchforks. just seems like a bunch of crazyness if you ask me. i'd like to see armed military personnel check the place out just to reassure folks that nothing too outrageous is going on back there.

Posted by: The Devil Location: Hell on Jun 3, 2008 at 09:07 PM
My therapist said I should tell the truth about this sick, twisted man called RAMA! he is a LIAR!

Posted by: The fine line Location: 2008 on Jun 3, 2008 at 01:30 PM
Ive only read some of these comments but it was enough to see t